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Post by Jill on Mar 21, 2009 7:09:30 GMT -5
Michael- Mick West- yeah. Niels gave us the heads up on him last year. Interesting for certain. The man is a multi-millionaire- why would he be playing with us- money is most likely not the motive for him. Does he believe that that there is no such thing as Morgellons- and it's really just some other Chronic illness (such as Chronic Lyme)? The DOP thing is worn out by now- a NON ISSUE. Does he think that those in charge of the various foundations are in need of some 'oversight'? I don't know what his motives could be. I am glad that he pointed out, as has Cliff M and Jeff Rense of recent days, that there are those exploiting sufferers with various 'Cures' for Morgellons- Hucksters.
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Post by friskers on Mar 21, 2009 12:09:17 GMT -5
Hi Jill Yes I understand what you are saying about bugs/adapted being similar to a love/hate crime. They both spent most of their life at LB back then and we were like family to them. i do also feel they were very hurt(usually the underlying emotion of anger) when they left so your analogy makes sense to me. behavior inappropriate? Surely I'm not one to judge anyone on being inappropriate!! ;D But Yes it was like a mushy sweethearts Valentines day around here ever day when they got coupled up LOL This is new news to me,Michael just emailed me about his NON relationship with the 2 and wanted to make clear hes not in any way related to them. Here s a quote from him............ "I'd just like to try to clear some things. Firstly there is no connection between me and Smileykins or Tall Cotton. They are simple two people who posted many comments on the blog. I've no idea who they are in real life, and I've no idea as to what their past is. They don't run Morgellons Watch in any way, they simply are very frequent commenters there."ALSO.. "Morgellons Watch does NOT say "you are all delusional". Perhaps some people do say that. But I'm not one of them. "And yes Jill Michael thinks morgellons in just already known illnesses , (not sure if he links Lyme in there or not) , but he has said menopause or skin afflictions........cant remember what else he listed as possibilities Michael told me he first found out about morgellons through wikipedia and from there he got interested in it. Yes Jill exposing Quacks was a positive thing too i agree!!
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Post by bannanny on Mar 21, 2009 16:56:43 GMT -5
So he's a millionaire eh? Do you know how he got that way? Devious people do devious things for money and it doesn't usually matter that they've made a million doin it. They always want more!
hugs ~~ bannanny
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Post by friskers on Mar 21, 2009 18:01:19 GMT -5
How do you know hes a millionair? maybe he will write us a big fat check to MRF when the CDC results come in with evidence morgellons is a NEW disease! ;D
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Post by Niels on Mar 22, 2009 10:01:05 GMT -5
he first found out about morgellons doing the dirty work for quackwatch on wikipedia. he's still doing that dirty work now, twisting a direct message about LYME and MORGELLONS from the NIH and turning it into his usual "morgellons in just already known illnesses". In fact the ICD classiciation box on the wikipedia morgellons page says "An unexplained illness which is characterized by skin manifestations including non-healing lesions, itching, and the appearance of fibres, although scientific consensus is that it is a new and misleading name for known illnesses." which is straight outta Michael West's lexicon of lyme denialism -- because this is the exact language the NIH uses "An unexplained illness which is characterized by skin manifestations including non-healing lesions, itching, and the appearance of fibers. There appears to be a strong association with LYME DISEASE." ... But they purposefully omit the LYME DISEASE part because quackwatch is strictly and strongly fighting against chronic lyme disease as a diagnosis, and long-term antibiotics as treatment. They have a milliion chronic disease alternatives to sell us instead -- for heart disease, arthritis, depression, mania, alzheimers, etc etc. All those ads you see on TV... those are their ads for their lyme denialist drugs. because the cause of 90% of the diseases those commercials are for... is specifically what quackwatch's profiteers want to make sure you don't know.
quackwatch is running rampant all over wikipedia, trying to coverup medical malfeasance, while bashing alternative medicine, nutritional supplements, and basically any business that competes with big-pharma and big-medicine.
see they've got a racket to keep going -- destroying the world through crisis -- and health crisis is their main weapon towards fascism these days (the economic collapse is just one arm of their pincer... health crises is pincer #2).... so quackwatch (and AMA, big-pharma, etc) spares no expense, human or financial, to make sure their disinformation is spread far and wide throught the internet. they profit. we suffer and die.
I wouldn't believe a word Michael West is saying. He is a weasel and he has an agenda. Men will say anything if you start talking sex to them -- it turns them into instant morons -- so good job at outing him a little more.
And yes, Michael West is probably rich, since he sold his company to activision the company that has a number of best selling games. Somewhere I have all his info stored, but it's not worth digging it up over this worm.
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Post by Niels on Mar 22, 2009 10:09:56 GMT -5
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Post by Jill on Mar 22, 2009 11:10:10 GMT -5
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Post by bannanny on Mar 22, 2009 17:15:17 GMT -5
Talk about worms... he's one of the biggest ones out there IMO.
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Post by Niels on Mar 22, 2009 18:51:32 GMT -5
All you have to do is look at wikipedia to realize that quackbusters is alive and well. they have control of the lyme pages and are have been trying to keep important info off, and bullshit on their page. Same for morgellons. If they lose a few lawsuits, it's nothing compared to the mass disinformation they're pushing at a bunch of supposedly independent seeming medical web-sites, including M.W. but also sciencebasedmedicine.com etc. And if you read the Dr. Rath article they've been all over wikipedia.
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Post by rhorn2006 on Mar 22, 2009 20:33:51 GMT -5
Michael- Mick West, and his like minded maggots will be dealt with one way or the other,,, time will tell...
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Post by Jill on Mar 23, 2009 10:38:36 GMT -5
The post about Quackwatch was to point out that when these people are confronted - in this case, with a court case, they loose. It does not diminish what you post about Quackwatch in any way. You may find that it supports what was posted on this thread and expands on it. Also- to point out that contrary to the statement at Quackwatch, where they state that they are funded mainly by small individual donations, commission from sales on other sites, etc- giving the reader the impression that there is no 'big' money behind their efforts, in fact stating that Quackwatch is not a front for the AMA and Big Pharma: Their actions prove the opposite- IOW that there are deep pockets funding these groups: www.quackwatch.com/00AboutQuackwatch/funding.html Doubtful that a company that is surviving as their statement on the above link is stating on "small individual donations...." could afford that sort of legal expense. IOW- they must be connected to some deep pockets or they could not continue to litigate. Read below about the Quackwatch affiliate- NCAHF- doing legal battle with some 43 companies. Quackwatch is closely affiliated with NCAHF- the National Council Against Health Fraud, which is most likely their source of funds for litigation. In the legal arena- PREcEDENT is everything. Precedents - found by either side in a legal battle will determine the outcome of any given case. It is the basis of the law. What you see at the link I cited is PRECEDENT. Important because the NCAHF was busy attempting to put 43 "Alternative Medicine Proponents" in California out of business, claiming health fraud. herballure.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=435&site_id=1#importFair use Excerpt: The very first case that came to trial was called NCAHF vs, King Bio (a manufacturer of about 50 homeopathic products). The NCAHF lost badly. Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Haley Fromholz wrote a long decision, virtually battering the quackbusters for wasting the court's time with their silly case. The quackbusters had accused King Bio of false advertising. At issue was the credibility of the NCAHF's witnesses, Stephen Barrett, and Wallace Sampson MD. The Judge thrashed their arguments. You can read the Judge's words in this original case decision by clicking here: www.quackpotwatch.org/quackpots/california_superior_court_judge_.htm You can find out who King Bio is by going to their website: www.kingbio.com end excerpt Obvious that they lost that round and yes they are still out there doing damage. I am also concerned about the Insurance Industry and Big Pharma using doctors such as Allen Steere to lessen their financial burden in the case of Lyme. Case in point: Per Actionlyme.org, Steere retracted or made adjustments to his original 'findings' as relates to Lyme disease: www.actionlyme.org/CDC_DOCUMENTS_1990.htm and here: www.actionlyme.org/STEERE_IN_EUROPE.htm Steere's original observations published in 1986: www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=423723&blobtype=pdfExcerpt: Steere said OspA and B were prominent antibody bands, originally, but later he said they weren't. How did that happen? Steere illegally used high-passage strains since Yale, Imugen and L2 Diagnostics wanted a monopoly on vaccines and testing: (read at above link) end excerpt More www.actionlyme.org/STEERE_IN_EUROPE.htm Excerpt: This is the CDC's Dearborn method: www.cdc.gov/mmwR/preview/mmwrhtml/00038469.htmNotice there is no band 31 (OspA) or 34 (OspB) After saying Lyme was a condition of a high antibody response to OspA and B, Steere deliberately invented a standard where OspA and B were not present as diagnostic antigens so Yale could pass off a bogus Lyme vaccine and also have a monopoly on all the national testing for Lyme, by being the only labs (Imugen and L2 Diagnostics) licensed to use Dave Persing's test with the Borrelia burgdorferi bug that had dropped the OspA-B plasmid. That was the scientific fraud and RICO part of the scientific fraud and racketeering in Lyme disease. That was the monopoly on testing. It all happened as a result of Steere fraudulently using high-passage strains of borrelia to determine that OspA and B should be left out of the standard testing for Lyme- yet OspA is the vaccine? end excerpt This Lyme issue, per above, is a great concern to me and should be to all of us. Quackwatch and Yale/Steere- different 'arms' of the beast- with the same goals-IMO Any and all of these Lyme denialists are lower than low. ALL of them should be sued. There are enough of us on this board with the PRECEDENTS - You have only to look at current news- Charla Nash (& the chimp w/Lyme) and the man in Illinois- with Lyme- who shot the Pastor to confirm that Lyme must be treated properly and now. PS- Rhorn- hurt them where it hurts the most- in their wallet- SUE
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Post by rhorn2006 on Mar 23, 2009 14:49:13 GMT -5
Jill,,,, as with all of your posts, great work!! Many thanks for all the efforts!!! Were they found guilty under RICO statutes?? RICO was created for organized group criminal efforts, it carries huge fines and jail terms for all involved,,, it easily apply s to many of these MorgellonsWatch like efforts, who finance fraud in the pursuit of public endangerment for a profit.. I fed that MorgellonsWatch group into the system through friends I know and trust in federal law enforcement last week. They assured me that every possible federal agency that can be pulled in, will be,, and no stone left unturned! Once they have been found guilty,, "and they will be" what's left "if there is any" will be court ordered as restitution payment to Morgellons sufferers!! Time will tell
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Post by mrc on Mar 23, 2009 15:02:27 GMT -5
rhorn2006, they will be caught when this all comes out into the open. Nothing on the internet is anonymous, even though they cloak their hosting account with that nameless service so that it comes up with no real information via WHOIS they can be tracked down, and very easily in fact. Payments are being made, IP's are being used, they can be found, believe me.
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Post by rhorn2006 on Mar 23, 2009 16:06:54 GMT -5
One of those involved in the investigation "in fact the first step" works for the defense department monitoring, sites, forums, blogs, chat-rooms, and so on, for terrorist related activity that the computer red-flags by key-words. He tracks them down to there IP and pulls there account and personal information,, then its handed over to investigators who access everything,, bank accounts and the like, looking for suspicious activity.. He tells me that no one can hide,, if they connect to the net, there an open book!! The MorgellonsWatch investigation is being handled as suspect terrorist activity because of several "RED-FLAGS" like the effort being financed,, the information being intentionally deceptive,, the intent being to subvert governmental processes and promote a danger to public health,, and other things like that.. And its no where near as complicated to convict someone for terrorist activity as is with a criminal offense. Legal language used in deceptive propaganda does not apply in a terrorist act, so all the "what I meant by that was" wont cut it!!
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Post by mrc on Mar 23, 2009 19:38:55 GMT -5
Totally agree rhorn2006, every IP is assigned via some ISP and most of the time they are static, even if dynamic they are still assigned to an account. I know a little about this myself, and tracked illegal activity to the Czech Republic and finally back to an individual in Canada, suprized the livin' @#$# out of him when we contacted him via email and provided evidence for his illegal activity (after which he took his site down and tried to disappear). We let him know we know who and where he is, now he has to live with that uneasy feeling.
Now they could do a lot anonymous, use wireless only at starbucks and all of that kind of stuff and make it very hard to track, but everyone can be found. And when the heat is turned up you can bet others will talk, they always do. I would bet they are worried right now, and quite frankly, should be.
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Post by Jill on Mar 23, 2009 20:08:10 GMT -5
Jill,,,, as with all of your posts, great work!! Many thanks for all the efforts!!! Were they found guilty under RICO statutes?? RICO was created for organized group criminal efforts, it carries huge fines and jail terms for all involved,,, it easily apply s to many of these MorgellonsWatch like efforts, who finance fraud in the pursuit of public endangerment for a profit.. I fed that MorgellonsWatch group into the system through friends I know and trust in federal law enforcement last week. They assured me that every possible federal agency that can be pulled in, will be,, and no stone left unturned! Once they have been found guilty,, "and they will be" what's left "if there is any" will be court ordered as restitution payment to Morgellons sufferers!! Time will tell Thanks, Rhorn! I don't think RICO comes from anywhere other than ActionLyme- The owner, is very bright and knows more about Lyme disease than anyone I've ever come across online. She uses the term on her link. Per the Connecticut Attorney General- it is Anti-trust. I'll say. www.ct.gov/ag/cwp/view.asp?a=2795&q=414284Excerpt: Fair use Connecticut Attorney General's Office Press Release Attorney General's Investigation Reveals Flawed Lyme Disease Guideline Process, IDSA Agrees To Reassess Guidelines, Install Independent Arbiter May 1, 2008 Attorney General Richard Blumenthal today announced that his antitrust investigation has uncovered serious flaws in the Infectious Diseases Society of America's (IDSA) process for writing its 2006 Lyme disease guidelines and the IDSA has agreed to reassess them with the assistance of an outside arbiter. The IDSA guidelines have sweeping and significant impacts on Lyme disease medical care. They are commonly applied by insurance companies in restricting coverage for long-term antibiotic treatment or other medical care and also strongly influence physician treatment decisions.
Insurance companies have denied coverage for long-term antibiotic treatment relying on these guidelines as justification. The guidelines are also widely cited for conclusions that chronic Lyme disease is nonexistent. "This agreement vindicates my investigation -- finding undisclosed financial interests and forcing a reassessment of IDSA guidelines," Blumenthal said. "My office uncovered undisclosed financial interests held by several of the most powerful IDSA panelists. The IDSA's guideline panel improperly ignored or minimized consideration of alternative medical opinion and evidence regarding chronic Lyme disease, potentially raising serious questions about whether the recommendations reflected all relevant science. end excerpt As to the Morgellon Watch group- they are not hard to find. There was a link- (now dead) that gave their names- but many posters here know the names of the 3 main posters. I truly wish you luck in dealing with them but somehow think they will dodge the bullet (not literally), due to deep pockets. That is how the world works. I have family members with Lyme and due to the doctors in my state turning a blind eye to the existence of Lyme disease, despite their symptoms of Classic Lyme to include the Bulls Eye rash - and much more, they have not been properly treated for the disease. Truly, I have a dog in THIS fight as well- let me know if I can help with legal research. Jill
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Post by bannanny on Mar 24, 2009 2:07:20 GMT -5
I honestly believe there's A L O T of money behind "morgellons watch" types of sites and "morgellons watch" kinds of people out there myself. Yeah, alot of money's behind morgellons... but it's money being spent to hide what it really is and not money that's gonna help us (the ones suffering) in any way whatsoever. It's money that's in the hands of the kind of folks we don't want it in. People get paid off these days to hide things... doctors get paid off these days to hide things. The way morgellons has been handled from the very get go pretty much speaks for itself IMO. It's not becuz it's so bizarre no one can wrap their head around it... it was made to be bizarre so they could have many a false pretenses to follow it up with, and go with. That doesn't make much sense how I'm putting it, but I think you all know what I mean.
We're in a deep hole tho, not that we chose to be in one of course. But it's gonna take an awful lot of somethin to get us out of it. I sure wish I knew what that somethin was too. I'm beginning to wonder if we ever really will be able to...
I'd seen a doctor 3 years ago who I actually liked... he made me feel there really were docs out there who would help me with morgellons. He left a good impression on me, mostly becuz he was one of the first docs I'd seen who was compassionate about it and one who had an open mind about it. At that time tho, he wasn't one I could have as my primary care doc. He was just a lung specialist I'd been referred to by my primary care doc (who didn't give a sh*t about morgellons.) But recently I went thru yet another HMO change over with doctors. It just so happened that he was one of the ones I now had to choose from to become my new primary care doctor. Since I remembered him being so open to morgellons, I obviously chose him.
I had my 1st appt. with him a little over a month ago which was more or less pretty quick. I was just in for a re-check on my lung x-ray and bloodwork... but of course the results hadn't gotten to him yet from my previous dr. (you know how all that goes.) So it was in and out and I didn't really talk to him much at all cuz he was packed full that day anyway. My 2nd appt. was today... I'd printed out some research papers on morgellons along with some of my pix and brought them in with me, figuring he'd be interested in reading up on it some more. But this time, the man had a whole different attitude... he's a different kind of doctor now than he was 3 yrs. ago.
When I handed the papers to him in the exam room, he became brusk, indifferent and almost looked as tho he had a smirk on his face. He didn't bother to look at much of anything and handed all I'd printed up right back to me. He didn't even want to keep them for himself to read or have them in my file. He simply said he couldn't help me regarding morgellons. I was pretty dumb founded needless to say, cuz he'd changed his tune so drastically from 3 short years ago. He was now acting the same as most doctors do when it comes to morgellons. I had actually felt he was one of those few doctors who were starting to come around and beginning to look at this in a whole new light... boy was I wrong. It sure seems to me somebody out there got to him before I could say another word about morgellons to him. More than likely, that somebody was my previous primary care doc who didn't even want the word morgellons mentioned in his office. So anyway, back to the drawing board where I'm gonna get some more white out and continue to erase the entire freakin medical association from my little mind.
Whoever came up with the term "money talks" sure knew what they were talkin about. Course they outta change it to "don't talk... the money will." What this world's become is really nothin but downright sad and so very sickening to my insides. I'm totally fed up with the whole fu*kin mess that's been made out of nothin but greedy evil people. I sure wish it would all just end.
God bless us all (please) ~~ bannanny
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Post by rhorn2006 on Mar 24, 2009 9:20:33 GMT -5
Jill,,, I thought you meant the "RICO ACT",, I get ya now! Great info Jill! BTW,, your post ..... "MW reminds me of a 'crime of passion'. What I'm saying is- when police find a person who was stabbed numerous times- it is usually an act of someone who was rejected by them- a spouse, boyfriend, or other close relationship. .... IOW- the intensity/passion in the act of hate is due to the love that once was. Love/hate other side of the same coin. ..... I could be wrong- but it seems to me as though the 3 of them- Marge, Tall Cotton and Smiley felt rejected somehow? ........ Could be? I know the pay for dissing sounds more logical- as relates to the 2- not Mick." Good call there Jill.. Based upon the evidence at this point,, “Michael” is the soul organizer and financier of the MorgellonsWatch dot-com site “at least on paper” Others who appear to be part of Michael’s group do not share in the financing of it, or the ability to access the sites settings. They are just people he has had contact with previously and share the same troll-like tendencies Michael has,, people who feed on the problems they create for others. Michael’s newly created “psychological criminal profile” says he displays sociopathic behaviors, a genetic “antisocial personality disorder” (1) Habitually deceptive; They are incapable of either knowing or telling the truth at any time. (2) Egotistical to the point of narcissism; They genuinely believe they are set apart from the rest of humanity by some special grace. They seek others or groups, manipulating a position of reference among them, a leader or supreme voice of knowledge all are expected to seek for guidance in there personal lives. They feel deserving of what ever they want, but feel that others are not deserving of the same things. (3) Scapegoating; They are incapable of either having the insight or willingness to accept responsibility for anything they do. Whatever the problem, it is always someone else's fault. (4) Remorselessly vindictive; When thwarted, exposed, not taken seriously, or rejected, unending “pay-back” through deceptive slander becomes there primary focus for being. (5) Morality; Genuine religious, moral, or other values play no part in their lives. They have no empathy for others, only seeing them as a means of satisfying there goals through manipulation. Under older psychological terminology, they fall into the category of psychopath, but unlike the typical psychopath, their behavior is masked by a superficial social facade and calculated deception. That sounds about right! Michael demanded anonymity to keep his personal life from being effected and damaged by his actions on MorgellonsWatch,, a site he set up with the soul intention of effecting and damaging the personal lives of everyone with Morgellons!! Anyway,,,, the “abstract” on Michael’s psychological profile (as I recall it from being read to me over the phone.. But there was a lot of commenting and laughing going on as well, so it may not be exact, but it is close..) He spends a great deal of his time isolated, searching the net for ways to occupy his time and satisfy his needs to feel superior to others. He has little if any personal friends. He does not do well in relationships. He is not a social person, nor does he do well in social settings. When meeting people in a social setting for the first time he comes off as “smug, superior, and rood” Those who have met him in the past would most likely avoid contact with him in a social setting. Unlike most sociopaths who become quite adapt at masking there real personality with a superficial social facade, appearing to be quite likeable, Michael does not. Having the ability to recall past and current deceptions, altering them to suit any new situation as it arises, is also something Michael appears to have difficulty with. Michael blatantly contradicts himself constantly, as if he is confused by his own direction of deceptive intent. The most likely scenario for Michael’s action are... Morgellons being a condition of controversy for several years,, a topic of debate based upon assumptions alone, and having little factual information available “until more recently” Michael viewed the topic of Morgellons as an effective means of satisfying his needs for superiority and control over others.. He began infiltrating Morgellons groups “blog’s, forums, chat-rooms” anywhere people with Morgellons were, and seeking answers. He played the part of “mister helpful and supportive” but lacking in medical training, morgellons knowledge, and not even having morgellons in the first place,, he did not reach the “guru status” he demanded, felt rejected and switched sides,, promoting as much ridicule and suffering as possible on those with Morgellons, as pay-back for our refusing to make him important in the morgellons circle.. His efforts increased with the media coverage,, and died down as the facts began to come out, ending his ability to feed on the ridicule and suffering he has caused us all.. That’s the basic scenario they came up with. It sounds like some teed off child having a temper tantrum,, but there not taking this lightly at all.. Sociopaths are dangerous people,, every serial killer there has ever been is a Sociopath,, and chances are Michael has committed a number of crimes in the past, that were not connected to him at the time. Most sociopaths who have money, either got it by victimizing others, or being payed to by someone else. The “Internal Revenue Service” will find out where every dime he has made for the past 30 years came from.. The main concern here is that “he willfully financed the intentional endangerment of public health” infracting upon a number of federal laws! Even though it appears he can do no more damage to those with morgellons, just because his site is no longer an effective means of revenge for him, it is rarely the case that a Sociopath would be willing to accept stopping before he decides to on his own. Being forced into stopping because his site has become ineffective, will only prompt him into looking for more dramatic ways of pay-back, further endangering public health and safety...
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Post by Jill on Mar 24, 2009 14:23:42 GMT -5
Thanks for the recap, Rhorn!
Interesting stuff. You wonder how the heck they come to those conclusions- just reading his materials. But then again- as you say- they did some background work.
I wondered about Sarah Bione Dunn- the woman that was posting on the board- asking for participants in her 'research' of USP (Unidentified Skin Parasites). In her words- she solicited for those with: "invisible, unidentified, or mysterious skin infestations."
Evidently, she roped some people in and then wrote a paper on DOP.
Take a Google on her- see what you think? She was a poster on Morgellonswatch.
Jill
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Post by ed on Mar 24, 2009 14:49:29 GMT -5
ah..........don't forget Nancy Hinkle. Ed
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