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Post by jeff on Jan 8, 2007 23:16:39 GMT -5
I AM STARTING TO THINK WE PRODUCE WAY TOO MANY FIBERS FOR A ORGANISM TO CAUSE THIS....THIS IS US DESTROYING OURSELVES...HYPER IMMUNE...FIBER PRODUCTION..SARCOIDIS LIKE..GRANULOMAS.....COULD THE FIBERS JUST BE WIERDED OUT GAINT GRANULOMA ? AND WE REACT IMPROPERLY TO ANY PATHOGEN...
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Post by Orion*** on Jan 8, 2007 23:28:08 GMT -5
I have been saying this for a very long time-- The body does produce fibers, filiments in reaction to a pathogen.. and there is a name for it--but I did not make a note: This is why I refer to the many faces of morgellons [ syndrome ]. The disease is exasorbated by immune supressants aka: [prednisone ] ***O***
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Post by zabrubon on Jan 9, 2007 0:31:50 GMT -5
Wow Jeff, I was thinking the exact same thing. If this is a deadly disease from the outside, why do we not have a fever etc?
Our bodies seem to recognize this bacteria or whatever it is and accept it. That tells me, it is family. Perhaps we are eating/drinking something that is the cause of the overproduction.
I have been reading up on skin and how it is made and it's composition. T stuff seems like it produces a new skin, like a scar would do, tougher and thicker. Bonnie
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Post by prevenge on Jan 9, 2007 2:11:06 GMT -5
that....
or this thing is just DESIGNED to circumvent our immune system all together.
-M
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Post by tonie on Jan 9, 2007 10:23:23 GMT -5
Personally, I don't feel it's a compromised immune at all that caused this. We had ours checked, have rarely ever been ill, and always have felt perfectly healthy. Still do. Even though I'm literally being eaten alive which I can tell...I am very in tune with what's happening, and because I've dug into the skin, I see what appears to be worms.
And alot of what I've read too...worms can invade any part of the body...and the host may be completely unaware of them residing inside, until symptoms begin to occur.
So worms wouldn't necessarily give us a "flu" type feeling or fevers, (unless they were damaging vital organs) but they could cause sweats and chills, as that is very common to parasite infections, and something too I've noticed this year, forgot about it, but I'll ask now.
Has anyone else experienced (I call it lock jaw) but I wake in the mornings with my teeth tightly pressed together...as though I might have been "teeth grinding" through the night. So many mornings my jaws have actually been sore...like I chewed gum all night long. And I've read too...that teeth grinding IS another symptom of having a parasite infestation.
I feel strongly that this is parasites, and everything we're experiencing is related to how the body reacts when there is a parasitic infestation. I feel we all did in fact eat something in common. Maybe fish, maybe meat or vegetables. Or heck maybe something canned, but I personally feel it is not the immune, or every person on the planet now with any illness, or older as the immune might be more inclined to be less strong, or everyone with any immune lowering illness would be affected too with this.
Heck anyone with any stress...which is everyone on the planet I'm sure, would then be suseptible as that too really lowers the immune. I'm sorry, I just don't see the "immune" system being the reason for this contraction.
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Post by hannah on Jan 9, 2007 11:09:59 GMT -5
I think it is parasites - I think these come first and then the immune system related problems. I also think that it is contracted by something environmental and that we have been exposed to something possibly because we have already got lyme disease, which leaves you open to opportunistic infection.
Regarding the jaw locking - sometimes I feel my jaw locked for just an instant and have to click it back into place. I have started to have terrible night sweats, past the menopause so not related to that. Some nights I have to change my nightclothes and bed clothes during the night because they are so damp - think this is a lyme related symptom.
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Post by abbienormal on Jan 9, 2007 11:22:09 GMT -5
I agree with Prevenge. Many of the theories make a lot of sense to me and how I wish they were true, but at the end of the day when I think about my hair and what is does and where it goes and how my morgs use pieces of it as spines, well then I think it has to be "bio engineering."
AbbieN
P.S. If this is an immune response, boy, we are really screwed and if this is a bio engineered atrocity, boy, we are really screwed.
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Post by jeff on Jan 9, 2007 11:26:34 GMT -5
Personally, I don't feel it's a compromised contraction. correction tonie....not a comprimised immune response...but a hyper./ over immune response......kills everything and sends fiber production in hyper drive..
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annb
Full Member
Posts: 109
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Post by annb on Jan 9, 2007 11:27:49 GMT -5
Hard to point to fish or meat, although they seem natural sources for parasites. Two children of our six never showed any symptoms. My vegetarian child (from birth) got this along with everyone else. A friend who has eaten nothing but raw fruits and vegetables for over twenty years got it, too.
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Post by tonie on Jan 9, 2007 12:29:49 GMT -5
Thanks Jeff.
Do you mean like "autoimmune" disorder?
Our bodies have an immune system that protects us from disease and infection. But if you have an autoimmune disease, your immune system attacks itself by mistake, and you can get sick. Autoimmune diseases can affect connective tissue in your body (the tissue which binds together body tissues and organs). Autoimmune disease can affect many parts of your body, like your nerves, muscles, endocrine system (system that directs your body’s hormones and other chemicals), and digestive system.
Or that's not exactly what you mean?
I think when we're "infected" with anything too, the body can do all kinds of things because of how the immune system kicks into all kinds of gears..so I can appreciate what you're saying.
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Post by tonie on Jan 9, 2007 12:35:22 GMT -5
Here are just some "classic" symptoms of a parsitic infection, and the word I used "lock jaw" should have been "teeth grinding or clenched teeth", because I for a year now wake up with my teeth clenched, and my jaw is actually sore sometimes, maybe from grinding during the night..anyone else? www.nvcentre.com/nvc2003/a_symptoms_paras_uni.htmClassic Symptoms: COMMON SYMPTOMS OF PARASITES IN HUMANS Constipation: Some worms, because of their shape and large size. can physically obstruct certain organs. Heavy worm infections can block the common bile duct and the intestinal tract, making elimination infrequent and difficult. Diarrhoea: Certain parasites, primarily protozoa, produce a prostaglandin (hormonelike substances found in various human tissues) which creates a sodium and chloride loss that leads to frequent watery stools. The diarrhoea process in parasite infection is, therefore, a function of the parasite, not the body's attempt to rid itself of an infectious organism. Gas and Bloating: Some parasites live in the upper small intestine where the inflammation they produce causes both gas and bloating. The situation can be magnified when hard-to-digest foods such as beans and raw fruits and vegetables are eaten. Persistent abdominal distention is a frequent sign of hidden invaders. These gastrointestinal symptoms can persist intermittently for many months or years if the parasites are not eliminated from the body. Irritable bowel syndrome: Parasites can irritate inflame, coal, the intestinal cell wall, leading to a variety of gastrointestinal symptoms and malabsorption of vital nutriens, particularly fatty substances. This malabsorption leads to bulky stools and steatorrhea (excess far in feces). Joint and muscle aches and pains: Parasites are known to migrate to encyst (become enclosed in a sac) in joint fluids, and worms can encyst in muscles. Once Ads happens, pain becomes evident and is often assumed to be caused by arthritis Joint and muscle pains and inflammation are also the result of tissue damage caused by some parasites of the body's ongoing immune response to then- presence. Anaemia: Some varieties of intestinal worms attach themselves to the mucosal lining of the intestines and then leach nutrients from the human host. If they are present in large enough numbers, they can create enough blood loss to cause a type of iron deficiency or pernicious Allergy: Parasites can irritate and sometimes perforate the intestinal lining, increasing bowel permeability to large undigested molecules. This can activate the body's immune response to produce increased levels of eosinophils, one type of the body's fighter cells. The eosinophils can inflame body tissue, resulting in an allergic reaction. Like allergy, parasites also trigger an increase in the production of immunoglobulin E (IgE). Skin conditions: Intestinal worms can cause hives, rashes, weeping eczema, and other allergic-type skin reactions. Cutaneous ulcers, swellings and sores, popular lesions, and itchy dermatitis can afl result from protozoan invasion. Granuiomas: Granulomas are tumour-like masses that encase destroyed large or parasitic eggs. They develop most often in the colon or rectal walls but can also be found in the lungs liver, peritoneum, and uterus. Nervousness: Parasitic metabolic wastes and toxic substances can serve as irritants to the central nervous system. Restlessness and anxiety are often the result of the systemic parasite infestation. (After completing a herbal cleanse, many people swear that their persistently grouchy mates or relatives have become a lot more pleasant and patient. "The most famous tapeworm of recent years belonged to the late opera singer Maria Callas. She had a serious weight and skin problem. When the tapeworm was detected and removed, ha" weight dropped, her skin improved and her temperament mellowed," says Gittleman.) Sleep disturbances: Multiple awakening during the night particularly between 2 and 3 AM, are possibly caused by the body's attempts to eliminate toxic wastes via the liver. According to Chinese medicine, these hours are governed by the liver. Sleep disturbances are also caused by nocturnal exits of certain parasites through the anus, creating the intense discomfort and itching. Teeth grinding: Bruxism - abnormal grinding, clenching, and gnashing of the teeth - has been observed in cases of parasitic infection. These symptoms are most noticeable among sleeping for children. Bruxism may be a nervous response to the internal foreign irritant. Chronic fatigue: Chronic fatigue symptoms include tiredness, flu-like complaints, apathy, depression, impaired concentration, and faulty memory. Parasites cause these physical, mental, and emotional symptoms through malnutrition resulting from malabsorption of proteins, carbohydrates, fats, and especially vitamins A and B-12. Immunie Dysfunction: Parasites depress immune system functioning by decreasing the secretion of immunoglobulin A (I&A). Their presence continuously stimulates the system response and over time can exhaust this vital defense system, leaving the body open to bacterial and viral infections. The following conditions might also be tell-tale signs of a parasitic invasion: weight gain, excessive hunger, weight loss, bad taste in the mouth and bad breath, asthma, diabetes, epilepsy, acne, migraines, and even the biggest killers: heart disease and cancer.
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Post by transhumanist on Jan 9, 2007 12:36:44 GMT -5
Orion, Jeff -If it were an overactive immune system, things like prednisone would help rather than hurt. A lot of people have overactive immune systems in some form - that's what allergies are. So, if Morgellons was an overactive immune system, it could technically be some new form of allergy. I've seen people who were allergic to the hormones their body produced naturally, so it's definitely possible. Prevenge - there're a lot of bugs occuring in nature that're excellent at subverting the immune system's response. That's the evolutionary goal of any bacterium or parasite, after all, so simply because the immune system isn't responding normally doesn't mean it was purposefully engineered.
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Post by jeanne on Jan 9, 2007 13:28:48 GMT -5
The common thread for why there are so many people on this board has to do with onset. The actions of the universities have so very much been tied to the fact and I mean fact that there has been an "explosion" of research in bio technology, stemcell research and human bodily reactions. There has also been an attempt on Transhumanist's part to deflect from the possibility that this is bio technological in nature. As our attempts at being aware of our environment continue on this board it is not o.k. to attempt to take this consideration out of the equation and I question Transhumanist's motives in dedicating himself to that end. There is a big push now to call Biotechnology Evolutionary biology and in fact for teachers and professors of it to consider themselves as evolving masters. Many writers and professors who are involved in experiments and research see themselves as "stewards" this way. This could all be fine and well when the intent is to help mankind and the planet. However the dark side will always rear it's ugly head as it has in this situation Even you Transhumanist must understand that in order to truly assist in the efforts being made by the "receivers" of this organism or complex or syndrome that due to it's Gulf War Syndrome and beyond nature we have to open our eyes to understand what was done there and what this is and how many contracts and patents have been won by doing research on the unsuspecting. Too many times have I witnessed a Beige colored mist rain or dust motes in the form of blue fibers falling from the sky. Too many times I have seen webs and all to many times I remember the insane things that were showing up in my house that I had to leave and destroy all of my possessions in order to try to escape this. Which I unfortunately have not. These bugs worms fibers and their presence in our bodies and the "samples" people are sadly collecting do not when researched point to a naturally caused cause. I would appreciate you not trying to subvert the necessary consideration of what is now in our environment that was not prior to this "explosion" of research. There are many aspects of the nano medical tools that have come up as relevant to the samples we collect. We must not rule this out. So I beg you Transhumanist not to deflect or dissuade but if you want to help perhaps help by finding understanding MD's or other humanists or even a naturopathic bioengineer who can reverse engineer samples utilizing the knowledge of all the recent research being done in the field. You seem to have the time since you don't have this. So stop saying it could be one of a million other entities since you don't have it yourself. Just about everyone on this board who isn't a perp for whatever agency or group involved has intuited at some point or other that this is more than a natural phenomenon. Your name Transhumanist suggests you know about evolutionary or synthetic biology yourself but maybe not. Thank you for your time in reading this.
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cb
Full Member
Posts: 145
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Post by cb on Jan 9, 2007 13:36:58 GMT -5
HI all , I talked to the cdc just before xmas told them that i was sick from a bacteric infection it was some thing going around was knot from morg . So i ask if this was a good singh becouse most peolpe dont get flu or cold of a fever that have morgellons . They said they never heard that before but if that is what is making you better keep thinking that way . So that is what i am doing i am think postive sometimes i dont think i have no more but then it comes back just a little to remind me i still have it . Iam so thank full that i can still work and rollerblade and enjoy life . take care god loves us
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Post by abbienormal on Jan 9, 2007 13:48:34 GMT -5
JEANNE,
MR. ABBIENORMAL AND I SAY BRAVO TO YOU! YOU HAVE NOT ONLY HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD BUT YOU HAVE SMASHED IT TO SMITHEREENS!
MR and MRS AbbieN (temporarily located in Austin, Texas)
P.S. Our apartment is covered in a perpetual film of blue fibers. Our apartment is 6 months old, we were the first tenants. We bought a brand new car, 2 weeks ago it is loaded with morgs and fibers too! The first time we opened the car doors on the sales lot, the fibers were already in the car. Is a brand new car having an extreme immune response? Is a brand new car responding to a bacteria? No disrespect to anyone, but something very unnatural is going on in this country.
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Post by ebgbgms on Jan 9, 2007 14:03:04 GMT -5
Dear Jeff and everyone, Through all the time I/we have had this disease I must say we all know there are still more questions then answers, as there are now more people affected then when the board was first started. On and on, foggy day, clear day this much I do know. Everything Jeanne said is true! No offense at all Jeff, or to anyone who believes other wise. To me now, it as easy as 123, this is man made and way out of control. Good post Jeanne. Everyone has their own belief's, are in different stages of the disease and different circumstances. All of us though are here from all over the US and other country's. Too many fibers for an organism to cause this? There is no right number, this is just WRONG. All are in my prayers and give us strength to find more answers this year. Always, ebgb
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Post by jeanne on Jan 9, 2007 14:29:27 GMT -5
Thanks and love to you all for the gravy that is validation, a rare treasure in this world. Big Love and Answers as well as solutions to us ALL.
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Post by transhumanist on Jan 9, 2007 14:53:52 GMT -5
Jeanne, I'm not out to disprove that it's "bio-engineered" in nature, but from what I have seen, I tend to doubt that it is. So far, no one has isolated the Morgellons pathogen, and thus we have no idea just what Morgellons consists of biologically. There's literally nothing pointing to anything at this point - we don't even know if it's bacterial, parasitic, or something entirely different. The only thing we really know is that people are getting sick. I'm not going to jump to the conclusion of bio-engineering because I've seen very little evidence for it, and furthermore, I know the natural world is fully capable of producing horrific things and doesn't always need man's help. Secondly, there's a mid-continuum possibility, as well. Humans may've had a hand in the appearance of Morgellons, but this might not've been bio-engineering in the sense that most people understand it. Things like the over-use of antibiotics and unscrupulous food additives - not bio-engineering, but not completely natural, either. I may not have Morgellons, but I sure as hell have gotten screwed over by other people's medical accidents. Overall, I think Morgellons research would be better served if everyone would focus more on *what it is* rather than *where it came from.* The immediate, important thing, is to find effective treatments, and this will be easier to do once whatever it is can be isolated. Speculating that it's bio-engineered/martian/a government plot/terrorism will provide no one with relief or a cure. Once we have an idea of what sort of pathogen it is, the origins will be easier to figure out, but discovering "conspiracies" should really be secondary to finding a cure.
All that aside, there's another issue I'm seeing here. You question my motives because I disagree with you (and apparently many people here, or possibly just a vocal minority) about bio-engineering. You also "beg" me not to "deflect or dissuade." I'm not "deflecting" or "dissuading;" I'm presenting something called a "dissenting opinion" that can often be useful in discourse. I find it ironic that someone with Morgellons or an interest in Morgellons would be so perturbed by dissent, given that, for a long time, it was only dissenting scientists who were willing to look at the problems, whereas the rest were satisfied with the DOP handwave.
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Post by transhumanist on Jan 9, 2007 14:58:51 GMT -5
Another note: It doesn't matter whether or not I have it myself. That's ad hominem, and therefore irrelevent, and doesn't change the fact that yes, it could be any of a million things. That said, yeah, I do know more than a little about evolutionary biology, and a bit about synthetic, but unfortunately, that'll never be my career field, and is more or less a hobby. I got snapped up by the liberal arts a bit too early to ever get a chance at the sciences. As for finding "naturopathic bioengineers," well, that might be difficult for me, since I don't subscribe to the naturalistic fallacy. I don't see the division between humanity in the natural world as anything more than a social construct, so I don't see ti-tree oil as any more special than a manufactured disinfectant (unless, of course, it works better, and unless we're talking about the prescription disinfectants, it often does.)
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Post by jeanne on Jan 9, 2007 15:41:37 GMT -5
ad hominem ad shmominam. Dissent away my good man. But don't spin me off as not being concerned about health thank you. Allopathic or naturopathic I too am from the school of whatever works. But that's "whatever works" and there are a lot of things that aren't that would otherwise work. You are still doing a great job of dissuading this avenue of research but Glad you don't have this though, it's quite obvious.
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