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Post by Chemist G on Jul 14, 2005 12:42:26 GMT -5
Ivermectin only kills larva, it doesn't kill adult worms. It also has been linked with leukemia--talk about cancer for the cure! Permethrin, when used in excess of 10+ times, has been linked to liver disease. Diatomaceous earth can cause bnreathing difficulties. Jeff, I thought you were the Spetra proponent. WHat happened? They came right back when you stopped, didn't they? That's what happened to me. Ivermectin paralyzes adult worms for a period of about a year (at which time you'd take another dose) but I really do not think we are dealing with worms.
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Post by Spunky on Jul 14, 2005 13:27:41 GMT -5
Hi Spec,
Thanks very much for your mail that addressed my previous questions.
In my limited understanding, osmosis works something like this: Cells exposed to a high salt concentration will lose water in order to equilize their inner salt content to be the same as that of the enivronment (liquid) surrounding them. When the cells lose water, the concentration of salts within them will increase. This continues until equilibrium is achieved. (Think of a grape losing water to become a raisin. Even if the raisin were given water again, it never turns back into a grape).
Conversely, exposure to a low salt concentration environment will cause cells to uptake water (swell) in order to dilute their inner salt concentration and equilibrate with the surrounding liquid. You can rupture a cell membrane, the surrounding outside layer of the cell, by exposure to high, then low salt concentrations (or maybe it was low, then high--too many moons ago and my memory fails me now, I can check my notes when back home). This rupture is called lysis, which obliterates them, causing cell death. Different cell types have different tolerance levels for salt exposures. I used to routinely lyse human red blood cells (in vitro or in test tube) in a research lab to eliminate them when isolating granulocytes or polymorphonuclear cells (basophils, eosinophils, neutrophils--types of white blood cells). Saline content buffered for human cells is 0.9%, or 0.9 gram per 100 ml of water; to induce cell lysis, we used 0.2% for short exposures, followed by equal volumes 1.8% to bring the liquid back to the balanced 0.9%. Red blood cells could not take the limited exposure to high, followed by low salt concentrations, whereas the polymorphonuclear cells were more resistant and survived the same exposures (although for limited time periods--a few minute intervals only).
I do not know much about protozoans--need to investigate this further, but it seems likely they do not tolerate exposure to high salt concentrations--maybe turns them into something like non-functional raisins or completely lyses them (thereby achieving our goal).
I have been using peppermint enzyme from Safe Solutions--Steve is a gem, DE, Borax, vinegar (Hulda Clark says to use white distilled because of potential mold exposure, but I had always heard to use cider vinegar before that), salt, povidone-iodine, and garlic for months now. Also recently not nice to toxins, the foot pads, black walnut tincture, etc.
They have recently converged into the area surrounding my jawbone as well as my cheek area near the ears. The sun and salt water have helped my eyes tremendously, thankfully. Will order Tetrasil ointment and have already purchased the Zapper--the one with the hand and foot paddles--it will arrive home when I do. Last night I used the enzyme on my skin, imediately followed with povidone-iodine, and left it on overnight--seems to be keeping things at bay for the moment.
My cat went missing last week. She was a house cat, scared and deaf, but I am quite sure she had this. My daughter is heartbroken, but I think it is a blessing in disquise, as I can't possibly eradicate this from my family, environment, a cat, dog, and hamster, though trying hard. I think she went off into the woods to die, even though I was feeding her the DE.
I plan to see a naturopath next, he has an MD in Internal Med and is also an ND. Does not accept insurance and is expensive, but, just in case he is open-minded and smart, I will give it one more try. Otherwise, will continue this battle with natural and holistic remedies, but I believe this may have been unleashed by the Bt genetic engineering to control crops, with no thought for repercussions as to what nightmare was being introduced to the environment.
Great website, Southcity!!! Thanks for your dedicated efforts--they are greatly appreciated.
Spunky
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Post by SpecueLatin on Jul 14, 2005 14:10:48 GMT -5
Hello chemist G
I hope you are having a fine day.
I believe you are a fairly new member here, if I am not mistaken. It is important to note, that there are many opinions about many things expressed on this board, and by all means, everyone is entitled to have as much or as little opinion about everything as they would like. Free expression is encouraged, within respectful limits, by the moderators and creators of these boards.
The, for lack of a formal title, Morgellons disease is not limited or defined to any particular set of characteristics. The variety and the combinations of symptoms, exposures, recovery, and relief techniques vary widely and overlap in the strangest fashion and you will see this as you see more posts. There was about 30 pages of posts up until just a short while ago when much of this information was unfortunately lost during an update.
The Morgellons disease is still very much in a discovery phase and you, as a scientist knows, that we need to encourage posts to facillate fact and data gathering.
Also, this board is multi-purpose, and we must never forget that first and foremost the function of this board is to support the members and participants in their struggle.
Please be sensitive to the many individuals here who may wish to post their thoughts or views. Freedom of expression is very important on this board since its inception, and I do not think I will be speaking out-of-turn to comment that the moderators want the members here to never feel intimidated to post their thoughts or feelings, discoveries or theories.
Further, what works for one, may not work for another, or it may, and we simply have to let each individual decide for themselves what information may be helpful, or not. It is a matter of respect to simply allow adults to have access to whatever information is available and to allow them to make their own decisions.
I do appreciate, as others on this board surely also appreciate, your desire to alert others to processes that you deem may be harmful, or helpful, from your professional 8-)perspective.
I hope you will understand this the way it is intended and please enjoy the rest of your day.
Sincerely, SpecueLatin
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Post by Jeff on Jul 14, 2005 15:49:01 GMT -5
"And these things seem to be affected by high pH chemicals like borax and ammonia so vinegar (acetic acid) shouldn't help."
Hmmm, are there any equally or more alkaline, yet safe things to drench ourselves in?
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Post by Lisa on Jul 14, 2005 16:41:52 GMT -5
"...enzyme from Safe Solutions--Steve is a gem" Steve as in Steve Tvedten? I emailed him back in June of 2003. I think he was familiar with Morgellons. He mentioned how often they were hearing about people with parasites that are not currently described in medical journals as being parasites. I'm wondering if he would be someone we should contact again? Maybe he would know of some other resources we could tap into? I talked to him on the phone once and he is very educated with regards to pesticides. I learned a lot from him. www.getipm.com/sitemap.htm
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Post by southcity on Jul 14, 2005 19:21:52 GMT -5
To Jeff: taking FOOD GRADE diamotaceous earth for a couple of weeks with food or mixed in juice really helped. (also took out some other critters I was unaware of harboring(:, this also has allowed me to refrain from taking anymore meds as I feel the Resistance of these things may be because of the high number of antibiotics prescribed in this country. Secondly get yourself a sticky-pad roller. Not the little one but the 12" wide or larger if you can find one. roll your carpets around those places you spend most time. for me its around my PC. Also residential clothes washers and dryers just do not cut it. They are too small and not hot enough. go to a laundry mat at use the largest washer they have as hot as you can then "cook" small loads in large dryers for longer than whats need to dry them, This has been the best thing Ive done in reducing the population of these things. Diamotaceous earth can also be mixed with warm water and sprayed on with a pump sprayer. this eliminates the dust from getting in your lungs. Food grade is best but considerably more $ than the pool filter DE you can pick up at orchard. If you insist on dusting with it go with the food grade DE. These things HATE peppermint. Peppermint oil diluted with water and applied to body feels great. Safe solutions does have some products that have helped a great deal with their enzyme cleaner being very helpful although they are somewhat pricey. I will be posting some Pict's and video clips at my site www.nondelusional.com within the next week or so be sure to check them out. I do believe that a tiny fly is one vector of this illness. Most of my research has pointed Mansonella Streptocerca as being our bug. The federal sites say that it is not endemic in this country but do not say it does not exist here. Food for thought, the feds are also recruiting for a study on Mansonella streptocerca as we speak. coincidink? maybe I don't know. Also Iron your sheets before bed this helps with a good nights rest. one last thing that I know a tot of you are going to warn against and believe me I don't care for it much either, but it allows the lesions to heal within days instead of weeks. Hertz once a month flea stuff. cant recall the name at the moment. it has .50 permethrin content as the elimite has only .05% content. When ever I get the telltale sign of a lesion I dab just enough of the product to cover the lesion only and this helps beyond words toward the healing of the lesion. I figure if they say to use one tube a month on your dog, than the one tube that has lasted 2 years and is still more than half full isn't as damaging as some may think. Only time will tell with that one. Anyway hope this helps and good luck to you. please keep us informed. Also please submit your story to my site to include with all the others so as to show without question that there is something going on here to not only friends and family but to these smug pompous health care profe... oops I almost gave them too much credit. these health care people whom seem to believe they know your body better after 5 Min's. than you do. thanks Southcity
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Post by Lisa on Jul 14, 2005 19:37:59 GMT -5
Southcity, I just had to say thank you for all of your hard work. You and EH are such blessings to us. I appreciate all the time and effort you have given to our plight. Excellent website!
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Post by Jeff on Jul 14, 2005 19:40:05 GMT -5
Southcity, Um, wow! I've been through some of the things you talked about, but had no idea you could mix the dae and still have it work - I thought that since it dehydrates the buggers I shouldn't get it wet. It should arrive tomorrow or Monday. I'm going to have my girlfriend submit my story. I think it would be interesting coming from another person's perspective. I'm really worried about doing quite a job on the bacteria, but nothing on the black specks. I guess I have this lingering fear that the black specks are larvae of some vector bug. That's why the ivermectin, much as I don't like it. I found some interesting articles about critter/bacterial relationships. Something about mapping the genes of the things trying to develop a medicine. I don't think they are what we have, but I wouldn't be surprised if they act the same way. Maybe this link will work: news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=594&e=1&u=/nm/20050714/hl_nm/health_parasites_dc
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Post by Chemist G on Jul 14, 2005 20:17:44 GMT -5
To Jeff: taking FOOD GRADE diamotaceous earth for a couple of weeks with food or mixed in juice really helped. (also took out some other critters I was unaware of harboring(:, this also has allowed me to refrain from taking anymore meds as I feel the Resistance of these things may be because of the high number of antibiotics prescribed in this country. Secondly get yourself a sticky-pad roller. Not the little one but the 12" wide or larger if you can find one. roll your carpets around those places you spend most time. for me its around my PC. Also residential clothes washers and dryers just do not cut it. They are too small and not hot enough. go to a laundry mat at use the largest washer they have as hot as you can then "cook" small loads in large dryers for longer than whats need to dry them, This has been the best thing Ive done in reducing the population of these things. Diamotaceous earth can also be mixed with warm water and sprayed on with a pump sprayer. this eliminates the dust from getting in your lungs. Food grade is best but considerably more $ than the pool filter DE you can pick up at orchard. If you insist on dusting with it go with the food grade DE. These things HATE peppermint. Peppermint oil diluted with water and applied to body feels great. Safe solutions does have some products that have helped a great deal with their enzyme cleaner being very helpful although they are somewhat pricey. I will be posting some Pict's and video clips at my site www.nondelusional.com within the next week or so be sure to check them out. I do believe that a tiny fly is one vector of this illness. Most of my research has pointed Mansonella Streptocerca as being our bug. The federal sites say that it is not endemic in this country but do not say it does not exist here. Food for thought, the feds are also recruiting for a study on Mansonella streptocerca as we speak. coincidink? maybe I don't know. Also Iron your sheets before bed this helps with a good nights rest. one last thing that I know a tot of you are going to warn against and believe me I don't care for it much either, but it allows the lesions to heal within days instead of weeks. Hertz once a month flea stuff. cant recall the name at the moment. it has .50 permethrin content as the elimite has only .05% content. When ever I get the telltale sign of a lesion I dab just enough of the product to cover the lesion only and this helps beyond words toward the healing of the lesion. I figure if they say to use one tube a month on your dog, than the one tube that has lasted 2 years and is still more than half full isn't as damaging as some may think. Only time will tell with that one. Anyway hope this helps and good luck to you. please keep us informed. Also please submit your story to my site to include with all the others so as to show without question that there is something going on here to not only friends and family but to these smug pompous health care profe... oops I almost gave them too much credit. these health care people whom seem to believe they know your body better after 5 Min's. than you do. thanks Southcity I use 8 teaspoons diatomaceous earth in 16 oz prepared Kleen Free spray (3 oz to 8 oz water). I spray this around the baseboards, carpet (especially near computer) and in the air ducts. That has helped immensely (worked far better for me than the tape thing or vacuuming the area). As for using that on your skin - it is not as effective as rubbing the straight powder INTO your skin - especially for eradicating the black specks. I agree about the laundry thing - even when using ammonia and/or borax in the wash you still don't get the effectiveness of ironing them or taking them to a commercial laundromat. What I HAVE found that works well and is a whole lot easier is to bag your sheets and throw them in the freezer during the day - similar efficacy to the ironing trick. The Safe Solutions enzyme cleaner helps but BEWARE - some peeps may be sensitive to the peppermint oil!!! They recommend a dilution of 1:1 with water for scabies so that's what I tried and it burned the HELL out of my skin!!! Plus their price is an absolute rip-off if you knew how much it costs to make it! The Kleen Free was a much better choice for me.
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Post by bigmike on Jul 14, 2005 20:53:49 GMT -5
Jeff,
I think that the use of the insecticides are contributing to the knocking down of our immune systems. It was after the three repeated full body uses and three full head lice treatments that this stuff hit me. There are web sites out there, where the whole message is to not use that stuff for the bad things that it can do to you and your immune system. I make my statements based on three dark field microscope examinations of my blood. I could see the damage I did to my immune system. And I could see the progress in rebuilding it by taking immune boosters. It takes a long time for the skin to grow outward and be renewed with new tissue. That is one of the reasons it takes so long to recover. I'm still working on it, but making progress. I use the gold bond powder as the last part of my nightly cleansing routine after the sulfur and Selsun Blue Shampoos and Tea Tree Oil and MSM soap washes.
Good Health to All
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Post by Jeff on Jul 14, 2005 21:06:52 GMT -5
Intellectually, I understand that. However, when this whole thing blew up, my girlfriend was pulling mite looking bugs out of my arm. They were not lice or scabies - we would have been able to identify buggers like that. Therefore, it's really hard to convince myself that these black specks aren't larvae, even a couple years after the last time I've seen a live bug on me.
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Post by Charley on Jul 25, 2005 9:23:08 GMT -5
Hi there. I just saw this post and am reposting the link: www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ISW/is_258/ai_n8592734The whole article is essential reading, but the most important part of that link is: Oral Salt Therapy Certain white blood cells (WBC) display several distinct mechanisms that may be employed for the purpose of killing invading microorganisms. One of these deserves particular attention in relation to killing the causative agent of Lyme disease, namely, the spirochete Borrelia burgdorferi. Neutrophils (a class of WBC) contain two essentially different types of storage granules, peroxidase-positive granules and peroxidase-negative granules. Peroxidase-positive granules contain myeloperoxidase, an enzyme that uses hypochlorous acid (HOCI) in conjunction with hydrogen peroxide, providing a source of nascent (atomic) oxygen for the purpose of killing invading microorganisms. Peroxidase-negative granules contain a family of large polypeptides (11 to 19 kDa) (Dalton, the unit of molecular weight) known as the cathelicidins or, in humans, hCAP-18. A segment of this larger or precursor protein (also known as a Bacteriacidal Permeability-Increasing (BPI) protein) is proteolytically removed by the enzyme elastase found in peroxidase-positive granules. The better-known substrate of elastase is the elastic protein elastin, found in skin and other tissues requiring elasticity. By incorporating elastase inhibitors into skin creams, attempts are made to inhibit the activity of this enzyme, thereby decreasing the ageing of skin. In Lyme therapy there is an advantage (described below) to increasing the activity of this enzyme, thereby stimulating the natural antimicrobial system. These short peptides, ranging from 12 to 100 amino acids, have the ability to assemble into larger units that form pores in the membrane surrounding microorganisms, thereby increasing the permeability of those membranes. In humans, one of these antimicrobial peptides has been dubbed LL-37. (11) See Photo 10, courtesy of Blood 96 (8) 2000. [ILLUSTRATION OMITTED] Both of these proteins, the cathelicidin and elastase, meet in the phagocytic vacuole, the cytoplasmic chamber in which resides the phagocytized microorganism. Within this chamber, elastase removes a short peptide capable of forming a molecular pore in the surface membrane of the microorganism. The pore formed from a group of the cathelicidins allows the efflux of potassium ions from the organism, resulting in swelling and eventual lysis. (12) Research has shown that, of all the proteins in neutrophil granules, the only protein capable of releasing the cathelicidin active peptide is elastase. (13) It has been demonstrated that the activity of elastase is enhanced by an increased salt concentration. (14) Through oral salt (12 g per day, see Chart 12), combined with large doses of vitamin C, the indirect killing ability of elastase is dramatically increased. (15) Increasing the sodium concentration surrounding the spirochete may also facilitate cell killing by allowing sodium ions to enter the spirochete through the pore created by the antimicrobial peptide. An increased intracellular sodium concentration, combined with a decreased potassium concentration, leads to spirochete death. The exact mechanism by which the human cathelicidin LL-37 kills Bb is unknown. See Chart 8.
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