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Post by zabrubon on Dec 13, 2009 0:51:04 GMT -5
Thanks Sidney and Toni. Sorry I did not answer sooner, I don't always get to the board on a daily basis. Hope your culture tests blow them all away. Keep going strong. CB
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Post by Sidney on Dec 14, 2009 21:24:33 GMT -5
I heard from the Natural Link Mold Lab today and nothing is growing in my petri dish thus far.
After recovering "somewhat" from the initial shock and awe, I called Chance and asked if I could send my images and he said sure.
I also reminded him that it was my understanding that if after the expected time frame lapsed they would consider placing the "specimens" in another growth media (or is it medium?) Whatever.... and he said yes, that could be done.
What is somewhat saving what's left of my mind is recalling that cultures from others always grew much faster than my own.
Today was the 9th working day since receiving my dish which contained skin scrapings taken by my M.D. Nothing was found in the 3mm punch biopsy either and that's ok too. It was packaged separately.
So, because lack of growth was not only disappointing, but embarrassing as well, I suggested sending "them" my petri dishes images despite the fact they were self-collected. Chance said that would be fine and he would speak with Sean (Dr. Abbott) about all this tomorrow, Tuesday, the 15th.
I scraped my jaw line and peri-oral area as carefully as I could scrap, and added plucked facial hair which to me is very telling.
There were no plucked facial hairs in the culture plate prepared by my M.D. and his nurse.
I am definitely willing to repeat this procedure. What do I have to lose? Only more money, which is not to be compared with basically losing the last 18 years of my lilfe.
I am NOT whining....I allowed myself to whine for an hour and told myself to get the hell over it.
I'm trying hard not to freak out and am not giving up.
Just having to give more thought as to what to do next.
Sometimes life just sucks warty Toads.
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Post by ruth on Dec 14, 2009 21:53:11 GMT -5
well this is interesting news, sid.
maybe your culture will take longer to take off?
i am with you in disappointment. yes, you have to do it again. if you didn't use the ear wax in this one, use wax and try again as you said you are getting growth at home.
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Post by Sidney on Dec 14, 2009 22:48:57 GMT -5
The ear wax is in a different Natural Link Dish and is very strange.
No fluff, no nothing except the yellow wax has grown to a glob and is all yellow. On the LID of the petri dish there's yellow sticky GOO.
Sure I am disappointed as can be, but this is no time to quit.
I'll be hearing from them tomorrow and decide what to do or where to go next.
Thanks, Ruth. It was pretty devestating.
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Post by freaky on Dec 15, 2009 3:33:27 GMT -5
Good girl. Don't give up the ship. You sure didn't deserve this surprise. You're in my heart, & prayers. Love ya, freaky
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Post by toni on Dec 15, 2009 9:50:17 GMT -5
That's right Sid, keep on, cause you've come a long way baby! And I do believe the Abbotts petri "agar" takes longer to grow for some reason. My specimens grew in 3 days in the petri dish from Prolabs. I had all that sporangia and white fluff (cotton looking stuff) full in that dish. I have now grown the EXACT same looking stuff in Abbotts petri. The only difference is: Prolabs agar grew it in 3 days, whereas Abbotts petri took 2 weeks. And thank you Sid for all you have done with all the sending of petri dishes to so many of us. So very much appreciated!
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Post by ruth on Dec 15, 2009 10:56:04 GMT -5
sidney, send in one of the cultures you have going. natural link will identify the mold whether it comes from their culture dish or pro-lab dish. send in the one with the most green and white fluff.
toni, when are you expecting your results in?
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Post by Sidney on Dec 15, 2009 11:03:26 GMT -5
You are right. The one I sent you last night with all the green stuff growing out of the white fluff, is the one I will send. That's the one with the giant red places on the bottom of the culture plate. I should say reverse of the culture plate to make it more clear.
I'll send it today.
I'm going to order another twenty dishes today. (for sharing)
Still disappointed, but determined.
Ladies, thank you for all your encouraging posts.
If at first you don't succeed, etc., etc., etc.,............
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Post by toni on Dec 15, 2009 12:02:21 GMT -5
Thank YOU Sid.
Ruth, possibly today! I hope. Should be any day now.
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Post by bannanny on Dec 15, 2009 16:00:31 GMT -5
Copying from other threads...
I haven't heard from Dr. Abbott yet, someone else from his office sent my results...
Alternaria alternata CPU/plate=2 % of mold=50%
Aspegillus niger CPU/plate=1 % of mold=25%
Chaetomium elatum CPU/plate=1 %of mold=25%
I know your results also show Alternaria ruth. I've also said from the very beginning of this nightmare that I felt Chaetomium was involved... at least in my case. Maybe it's what's making things so bad here. Reason I say that, is in my first or 2nd year of this we had the house tested for mold. It was one of the ways I was looking for answers to what I was experiencing. Both Aspergillus and Chaetomium were found, along with others that aren't showing in my results.
I wish I could find that first article I came across about Chaetomium, but I haven't been able to find it again since then. It said more or less, that once Chaetomium takes over, you might as well burn your house to the ground and then bury the ashes... but that more than likely wouldn't even rid it. I'm gonna keep trying to find that article tho, cuz it makes 100% sense to me as to what's happening here and to me as well.
I'm also starting to think that whatever the morg pathogen itself is, it could be possible that it's replicating the molds found in our homes, which would also explain the subtle differences we show... different molds in different environments. Yet, we all share common molds as well. It could also be replicating insects, etc. which would explain the different symptoms we show pertaining to insects, parasites, etc.
It's just a thought, but one that makes sense.
hugs ~~ bannanny
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Post by fritolay66 on Dec 16, 2009 1:30:02 GMT -5
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Post by jj on Dec 16, 2009 12:09:17 GMT -5
Hey all, good work with the mold investigations and continued good luck. Please don't take offense to questions regarding how it all is taking place. I've read some good ones myself. Here's one for Toni. I saw your three day growth images on another thread somewhere which brought these questions to mind. What topical (or other) treatments are being used? What effect might they have on the outcome of the growth? Toni, your milk and yogurt is one example. Has anyone asked questions of those helping in your investigating similar to these? From my perspective and in my environment only ....... I wouldn't be able to get (human sample) results that were not tainted by my own environment. Just one example ...... you should see what grows in a clean Brita pitcher from the tap water we shower in. . All that said, it is not done to discourage but to encourage. This type of thing needs to be done and your work may very well lead to further participation in this area ...... which is what we want. JJ
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Post by Sidney on Dec 16, 2009 14:50:43 GMT -5
I understand your concerns and am not in the least offended by your comments.
I posted the following in the other thread, but want to reply here as well.
As a reminder only, Natural Link Mold Lab also offer bacterial identification using their culture plates with an appropriate growing medium. We all have "normal" fauna and flora. What we'd like to know is whether we have natural fauna and flora that has gone wildly out of control, (yeasts included) or growth of another nature that creates this unspeakably horrid "condition."
I've heard from Dr. Abbott's lab and have been asked to send them my dishes which I will do today, via Express Mail.
What a great group they are. Helpful , kind, caring and interested.
When I do a scraping I always add plucked facial hair from above my upper lip and from my chin.
I do this because to me the hairs are often so deformed and even last night when I plucked a black one from the area between my nose and upper lip, there was a small white fiber attached to the hair, encircling it almost completely.
I could NOT see the fiber without 30x magnification.
When my M.D. did the scrapings he did not pluck facial hair. I forgot to ask him to do that.
Since collecting specimens for the Petri dish I have stopped using Neosporin and Itraconazole.
I just wash my face and let it air dry or gently pat it dry with a paper towel.
At night I clean my face with Seabreeze and tape over the lumped up, callused area using pink tape.
I definitely don't want a false positive result.
We just need to KNOW...
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Post by toni on Dec 16, 2009 14:59:30 GMT -5
I just heard from Abbotts lab - since I'd written them yesterday wondering (if mine was determined yet).
And they said they've isolated 2 fungi so far, but it won't be till next week I get the results.
JJ, GREAT questions. I was wondering that too, what happens "because of what we use" topically on our skin.
The one thing that I've seen in ( 2 different labs petri dishes) of mine is this. I've grown the same looking specimens in both.
The other is, Ruth and Sid and Kammy or Jeany I believe also are growing the what appears to look identical to mine too, and the good part is, they're not using the milk and yogurt.
I was wondering that myself ( is my yogurt or milk) causing any growths, but after seeing others grow the same thing, I know now it's not 'that' causing the growths, unless they are using milk and yog. But I don't think they are.
The other thing I use is Bismuth Subgallate, with either silver aloe gel, or ( Ketoconazole and Itraconazole mixed together) and applied topically. Or (Terbinafine and Itraconazole) mixed and applied topically.
Acutally, I've tried Fluconazole too topically.
I really have tried all kinds of combos, but these have been the latest in the last couple of months (which might influence) growths, I don't know though for certain.
If anyone else is using these, please let us know.
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Post by ruth on Dec 16, 2009 20:24:45 GMT -5
TONI........TONI...........TONI.........TONI......... NEXT WEEK PS: my culture was done under sterile technique. because the prolab was done under clean and not sterile, i do not refer to it.
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Post by toni on Dec 17, 2009 8:15:28 GMT -5
Ruth,
Yep, next week for the results. I understand why after seeing my new batch of growth in another petri dish that is taking just about 2 weeks to show itself. Imho, the Abbotts agar (which I understand is quite a common agar) does seem to grow slower than the Prolabs agar grows things.
I know, next week seems like forever when waiting.
It's interesting because what I've grown here at home in the two different (companies) petri's look like the same stuff. But Dr. Abbott said he's isolated ( 2 different fungi ) so far. So that's sure got my curiosity going, because I really do believe I've got the Rhizo....and I'm anxious to see what the other is.
I know in my "pickings daily"...using yogurt and milk, something I see consistently are amber colored "flecks" of things. Thousands of them. Thye're as tiny as the periods at the end of the sentences here. I don't have a clue what those are, but I'm hopeful they'll now be identified.
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Post by Sidney on Dec 17, 2009 9:23:31 GMT -5
Toni, the amber flecks are a real curiosity and I'm sorry you have to wait a few more days, but hopefully the wait will be worth it.
Since the mold issue has reared its ugly head I'm reminded of a few events in the past.
One of the participants in the Study in Oklahoma was a family consisting of a Judge, his wife who was an attorney, and their two sons.
During the time their home was under construction there were heavy rains. The buildiner continued to complete the house although insulation was present. It wasn't removed and replaced.
The wife was the only person who became ill. Typical symptoms we have all experienced and serious debilitating health issues which were never resolved to this date.
Eventually the house was declared unfit for habitation and thankfully, Insurance kicked in.
Another time I recall a family was forced to move from their newly constructed townhouse due to mold. They moved and never returned.
I could list other similar happenings, but you get the idea.
Water damage does appear to play a huge role including the critter issue.
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Post by toni on Dec 17, 2009 11:13:20 GMT -5
This is from yesterday's batch of "pickings". One of gazillion of these spongy like balls that form. This entire "GLOB" of stuff pictured here with my needle pointing to it, is barely bigger than a granule of salt. The whole thing is that size - approx a salt granule. So you can imagine how tiny these "amber flecks are". They're extremely tiny. Teeeeny tiny. See these amber flecks, they're in all my specimens anymore. They're actually almost impossible to see with the naked eye. But under the scope my yogurt and milk mix adheres to this yellowish gell like substance, and the amber flecks of all shapes. The milk/yog mix causes a coagulation of this fluid stuff that's in my face tunnel, and then it comes out a lot easier. If I didn't use the mix, this particular stuff would be a fluid the "yellowish crud"...and the specks would then not "glue" to anything as they do with the coagulation caused by the yog/milk mix. After the milk/yog mix touches whatever this is in my face tunnel, then it forms balls like, and the whole enchilada then comes out, and it's loaded 'every chunk that I remove' is loaded with these amber flecks. I get 'hundreds" of these type "globs" out daily, and they're all loaded with amber specks. See how weird this is? Ugh. Oh...the other thing I find bizarre, is MANY (thousands) of these flecks also are sort of "heart shaped" as the one I'm pointing to also. How wild is that? These are "something" significant, hahah no kidding, and I'd sure LOVE to know what on Earth they are.
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Post by ruth on Dec 17, 2009 11:22:39 GMT -5
toni, under the scope i am seeing the sporangia flatten out and join together to make the amber chunks.
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Post by toni on Dec 17, 2009 11:30:41 GMT -5
Ruth, that's incredible. Now, I am aware that "sporangia" of Rhizopus, will join together and swell, when they're doing their thing. But these "amber particles like I've pictured here" are these the ones you're talking about? Because "to my understanding" (sporangia) are those cherry ball looking round things that are the spores basically in the cottony growths we all had. So, I'm sorry I'm not clear. Do you mean "sporangia" in the cottony growth you're seeing joing together? Or well...heck, I'm not sure what you mean. Sorry. Thanks Ruth.
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